Hako's Monthly eroge review: a disappointment.

[Checkmate]

IMHO it's not about how many VNs you have read, but it's about how DEEPLY you understand what you read. Due to limitation in Japanese language knowledge, very few people here can enjoy the stylistic elements in a LN or VN, and care only for the "plot" (or the "story"). Even non-Vietnamese are no different. I have seen enough eroge reviews on the Internet to tell that. Aside from a few people like Accany, very few would comment on aesthetic elements. Most of them would jump straight on evaluating the plot and character development, which is something on a grand scale and actually requires more careful examination to give a fair judgment.

This is EXACTLY why I hate the english eroge scene. They are faggots and scums, may be with a very few exception but most of them are. And then, seriously speaking, I don't want anyone here to look up at them being awesome and trying imitate what they are doing. No, I want Hako to be different.

You have never been to VNS or SA

Actually I have been there, I've seen them, and of course, I was disappointed as well. Though it wasn't my concern, I just moved on. To be honest, I don't exactly care about English scene and the Vietnamese scene, atleast up until now when I get to see Hako. English scene, hahaha we will leave at that, I hate to break it but I see most of them as insects, they don't even worth my time.

This may be shocking for you, but when you starts a thread like that, Vietnamese people are most likely to assume you to be a clueless kid, not a Vietnamese returnee

So, Vietnamese guys treat clueless people like that... now that's a shocking fact. Look, I've been at places and most of them treat clueless people with courtesy and forgiving, except Vietnamese, why can't we just be courtesy. Of course, I've seen helpful Vietnamese too but it's way too rare... This is actually disgusting, so let's not go into that anymore.

 

[shindo]

Well, I see things a bit different. I'm willing to answer any question from newbies whether how naive their questions are (and almost hako member will do it, too, e.g Eushully and Alicesoft topic). But the problem is how a newbie ask questions, lots of them lack respects. e.g: "Ê, cho mình hỏi chỗ này đi...".

From my points of view, problems are in both sides (questioner and answerer). If they respect each other a little, I think everything will different.

 

[archer360]

Stand on the cliff, looking down to people. I-o-no how to explain but have to accept it as one of VNese (and most Eastern Asian) "bad habit" not only on the internet but also IRL too, If you happen to be an immigrant to other country, you'll understand the feeling of being looking down by people from the same race, they ve arrived first, they knew the way things going around and to deal it em, yet they even turned their back on their fellow "brother/sister" from their motherland (even they're blood related). It's like they claimed em as "People of that Host country" and forgot where were they came from, just like a butterfly looking down the worm without knowing himself used to be one of em.

Maa... let's stop it here! All I want to tell you guy is do not feel superior to other who came here after you, this is not Paper Plane, some of you "senpai" should drop that behavior before "accidentally" dampen your "kouhais" spirit. You guy just took off not long ago and may not fly further than that paper plane, so feel free to adjust your wings to get more attentions. Some of passing by faggots like me can only do a bit to support you guy but you guys have to do the rest. to make it bigger is far off your hand, but keep it as peaceful playground for newcomer.

Most of your "Kouhai" is a shy girl, they afraid of being seen as a noob (even some of em try to put a very well cover), I think you guy should write some more "guide thread" to some certain VN (aside those that are already known) that you like (not those of Key, Leaf or Circus)

BTW: Go to IRC, it's not very hard to obtain a "licensed" version of MiRC, f*ck it, this is not US!

 

[Oboku-sama]

I have to say that I'm ashamed for what I did for the monthly eroge review but there is one thing I'd like you to know is that this is the style I learnt from my predecessors (Coffin-sama and taThan) or somehow misinterpret their style. Honestly in my opinion, I don't want to do this monthly eroge review since it is straightforwardly redundant. It is basically the same as the Zen and Micchi's blog but just only in Vietnamese. The only difference is that when I commented on these lists, I tended to make it humorous and full of trolls (and that's what I did for the last year's September and I received a lot of compliments for it. Thus, I thought this is the right way to do things). I'd much prefer single eroge's preview more but I still have to do this one since it's considered as a tradition. I have to confess that it's basically impossible to do a throughout preview and comment on all the eroges in the list with my Japanese level (I can only do on seriously one at time), limited knowledge and experience on eroges. Thus, I sincerely apologize everyone here who were expecting a decent review for making this nonsense and I will reflect on my actions.


I'd like to have everyone here's attention and opinions on how the translating group should work. But first, I'd like to say a few things that I forgot to mention (which I should have done earlier and it's a grave mistake) and some proposals.

1/ By constructing the team, it's a good opportunity to get members to pay attention to eroges of producers that are new or strange to them because before they make comments, they should have some look at the homepage, game's web and (hopefully) the history of the producers, what type of eroges they usually make and their popularity (that's how I learnt many producers without actually playing any of them). Many people tends to ignore eroges or producers that are no famous and this is a good chance to get people to learn more about them (though only the staffs).

2/ Reflecting on what I did, I will strictly supervise the quality of the list from now on. By this, I mean I'll make sure that there is no superficial or thoughtless comment in the incoming list and from now on; and persuade every member in the team to do a throughout research beforehand. I know that I may sound too demanding and serious for it but I beg all the staffs to lend me your hands to make Hako a better place.

3/ If possible, I'd like to have one member or two (or maybe even more ambitious, a 2nd team) to work on incoming released eroge's preview. This is a little bit hard since it requires not only reading throughout the homepage but also playing the trials. Newbies who want to contribute are welcome since this is an opportunity to learn how to approach seriously one game that is not released yet. I will personally try to get some tips from the experienced people on how to overcome the language barrier to understand the game and the producer. The reason why I proposed this idea is that Vietnamese's Visual Novel community in general is quite insensitive to new information and updates. Unless someone is experienced, has a lot of passion towards or decent Japanese skill, he or she may not know anything beside the relics of the past. And again, this is considered as a very ambitious proposal even for me. However, I still want to say it to hear everyone's opinion.


At last, I have to thank you Checkmate for giving objective and straightforward comments on the subjects. If it was not thanks to this topic, the same thing would keep going on forever. I hope that you can keep giving feedback when I do something wrong.

 

[Ciela]

Well done guys. And you Check Mate -san. You got the good point. I impress your words which pointed directly to exact problem and also our responsbility. But there're something I think that you still don't understand. Let's slowly talk about this situation.

Viet Nam has many restricts for sharing stuffs, eroge certainly is one of that. If you were once Vietnamese, you should have known whatever relates to sexual content has been banned literally. VNs / eroges, this type of game is for high level player who have enough knowledge and possibility to play in an extent route, thus far than average ones can do. So the fanbase of VNs, eroges in Viet Nam is few (very few). All Hako users maybe considered as cadet elite, not to mention leaders. As we don't have that much fanbase to wide open, our contry law is the biggest brick wall.

All the leaders here were once very active members, I believe they had done their job to newbie; how to play, full guides, wise advices with tender attitude. How beautiful past. Generation changed, nowaday newbie nowaday are totally newbie. They just open their mouth relying on others to help them full way but not even try to find out thing they need. Our generation is opposite so we can't stand with them anymore further. If more and more ask you the same question when the big guide is in front of them, would you please to help ? My answer yes, limited time. We were going far beyond our durability.

So, Vietnamese guys treat clueless people like that... now that's a shocking fact. Look, I've been at places and most of them treat clueless people with courtesy and forgiving, except Vietnamese, why can't we just be courtesy. Of course, I've seen helpful Vietnamese too but it's way too rare... This is actually disgusting, so let's not go into that anymore.

Not totally true. I've accounts on many US and different language forum, they don't treat others nice as you said, everywhere has its problem. Community raise by its members' consciousness so I still have hope if they would grow up. Mostly on international forums I have seen ppl respect each others. How sad but true. Vietnamese ppl like what you see is new generation (not all ofc). We are older and can not get along with them, the same reason. That's why we hide somehow.

I don't runaway. You have mentioned accurate problems which are currently going. I'm very sorry and I conceive your words. Like Hako-chan has said, we will find a possible way to solve this, for now and the future. But in the higher POV, we need others cooporate.

 

[Oboku-sama]

The earlier post is quite long so I'll post this one seperately

I think they should stop the whole pick-pass thing and comment on the summary,art only

At least check on vndb about those game first and stop trolling, OK.

It seems that you are mistaken here since I'm the one who did the list and all the trolls I made are actually based on what I have learnt from vndb, the homepage,... The trolls I made here are not some random trolls that suddenly popped up in my mind. I spent the whole time thinking on how to troll to make it fun while trying not to upset other people. Of course, this time is absolutely terrible since the list is too late already and I was rushed to finish it (do not have enough patience to do everything throughtout like in September). I have already added that this list has a terrible quality already. However, there is no denying that I'm still responsible for this crap. I'll reflect on it and stop all the trolling stuffs from now on.

In fact, I didn't know those were available in English at all. May be you guys should think of something similar and write something original too (aka not a translation), once per month, or once per two months. They were really helpful for me and I've begin to plan to adopt some for AS.

That's a useful advice. I will keep that in mind and try to come up with some new articles (though I can't be assured of the quality)

 

[Checkmate]

If you were once Vietnamese, you should have known whatever relates to sexual content has been banned literally... our contry law is the biggest brick wall.

I'd expect this bullshit law to be lessen in practice and ignored totally. Well look at China, they had the same law, yet their fanbase is big enough that probably about the same size of Japanese's market. I don't think the law actually have that great impact. And yes, all Hako members are the pioneers of the new world, the future lies in everyone hands here.

If more and more ask you the same question when the big guide is in front of them, would you please to help?

As much as I hate to do it, I still need to give them the guide and point all questions to the guide or let them ask question in the guide thread (or comment on it). In fact all AS staff are required to do so.

...everywhere has its problem.

True, the point is the culture of the place. If everyone from leader to member in that forum trolls, treat others like crap, you don't expect anyone there to treat anyone nicely. But if a forum has full of nice people, then the result will be very different. Would you put some effort into making Hako a better place than >o9k place or you look at the forum next to you and say "I'm doing the same of what they did, that's good enough" ?

Let's not make excuse. You can make excuse with teacher at school and he will only take you about 30% of your assignment at most but in real life, there's no 70% is a C-... there's only a F or not an F (Fail or not Fail). But what am I saying, since when school actually teach anything rather than faggotry.

Vietnamese ppl like you see is new generation

Yes, what they taught in school are faggotry indeed. But that doesn't mean we shall bring ourselves to their level at all. We are different, we are unique, we don't just align ourselves be "a bit better than them". True story is: AS never align itself to any other famous forum, we have unique approach to everything, and we don't even care about the existence of the other forums since they aren't our concern at all right of the start.

To cap up, if you want to make Hako a different place than >o9k places we already had, think about it. You're certainly on the right track here, and my point in this thread simply to give you some advice.

As for Oboku-sama

I'd like you to know is that this is the style I learnt from my predecessors (Coffin-sama and taThan)

I'm not blaming the problem on you or anything, it's not like Coffin-sama and taThan's rants were any better to begin with. It was just a mere example comes in handy, nothing more, nothing less, don't take it too personal. Coffin-sama might have played more eroge than you and understand it a bit more though but with all due respect, his understanding isn't that great either. Seriously, if the monthly list is full of "Pass" "Pass" etc etc don't bother to comments on it then just skip it altogether. It's not helpful, it's not entertaining, and it's not appropriate either.

Also don't try to be moral fag: Don't come by a Nukige and call it sucks and pass just to prove others your point of view in this morality sense. I've played a fair amount of nukige and many weren't that bad. Nukige also provide good entertainment value, they aren't just fap game but that's my opinion, try to be neutral about your opinion and go by the facts, not feelings. I've seen the Nukige box and the Nukige discussion, this is the right direction. Everyone has different preference and opinion, and that doesn't mean we hate it, we can disrespect them. My motto is: Don't like what I do? Don't Flame

Ofc, that doesn't mean I would suggest Hako to turn into a hentai lair like all the >o9k forum out there too, don't take me wrong. Most people in this world (yes) mistake eroge for some sick adult game (thanks to lều báo). And we are here to change that landscape, aren't we?

 

[Oboku-sama]

@checkmate: Sorry, that's just old habit from when being in Vnsharing.

After reading this thread more carefully, I want to ask Checkmate-san what you meant in this part. I'm not sure what you are talking here.

This is EXACTLY why I hate the english eroge scene. They are faggots and scums, may be with a very few exception but most of them are. And then, seriously speaking, I don't want anyone here to look up at them being awesome and trying imitate what they are doing. No, I want Hako to be different.

btw: I'll be a little bit straightforward here. I don't like the way you talk bad schools. Schools, parents, books and eroges are 4 things that made my personality now so please try not to talk as if schools are so useless.

 

[Checkmate]

After reading this thread more carefully, I want to ask Checkmate-san what you meant in this part. I'm not sure what you are talking here.

Refer to this:

Even non-Vietnamese are no different. I have seen enough eroge reviews on the Internet to tell that.

I assume he meant some english people who think they are all high and mighty because they play >o9k eroge that grant them the right to bash it. Fact is: no.

 

[delacroix01]

I'd expect this bullshit law to be lessen in practice and ignored totally.

That will be like, well, 30 or 40 years later. They are not going to change it in the next 10 years anyway.

Well look at China, they had the same law, yet their fanbase is big enough that probably about the same size of Japanese's market. I don't think the law actually have that great impact.

You know, China has 1.3 billion people, so it's not surprising that their fanbase has such a big size.

But if a forum has full of nice people, then the result will be very different.

I think you're being idealistic. Every forum has trolls and elitists. Moreover, because each person has access to multiple places, forums have a tendency to assimilate each other, even though they don't admit it.

Well, I'm no staff here, and I really can't think of a solution. Still, I think this thread has more or less shown some results, so good luck on discussing with responsible members.